JB 2 Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 One thing not brought up yet. If you get insured through obamacare you are covered only in a restrictive area. I will use as example a scenario we can all agree is plausible. If some drug dealer with obamacare in Binghamton takes a "re-up express" to the Port Authority and gets shot outside on the street. He is responsible for his medical bills. Remember the early cell phones with Regional Service? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMoss Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 One thing not brought up yet. If you get insured through obamacare you are covered only in a restrictive area. I will use as example a scenario we can all agree is plausible. If some drug dealer with obamacare in Binghamton takes a "re-up express" to the Port Authority and gets shot outside on the street. He is responsible for his medical bills. Remember the early cell phones with Regional Service? What does the restricted area for Broome County look like? Is there a map? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB 2 Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 What does the restricted area for Broome County look like? Is there a map? That will be determined by what "pool" they are placed in. The ones who will notice less help are those now on medicade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conklincolt Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 One missing piece of the Unaffordable Care Act is that if you do not buy insurance and pay the "fee" (fine) you are responsible for ALL of your medical expenses. Nothing will be covered. There will be many people who take the risk, get sick, and then end up financially ruined. This is a disaster of epic proportions. For some people they would be better off financially ruined.then they would qualify for free everything they cant get now working 2/3 shitty part time jobs now hanging on by a thread living day by day and are just over the cut off limit for benefits, so for them that case wouldnt be so bad and most likely wont upset them much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wanker Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 One missing piece of the Unaffordable Care Act is that if you do not buy insurance and pay the "fee" (fine) you are responsible for ALL of your medical expenses. Nothing will be covered. There will be many people who take the risk, get sick, and then end up financially ruined. This is a disaster of epic proportions. Most people can do the math. No insurance=no coverage. Still stuck in the 90's? People have been getting sick and losing their jobs, houses, savings and ending up destitute for years. Making it sound like Obamacare will do that=insanely dumb and irresponsible. Try again when you have something real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conklincolt Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Most people can do the math. No insurance=no coverage. Still stuck in the 90's? People have been getting sick and losing their jobs, houses, savings and ending up destitute for years. Making it sound like Obamacare will do that=insanely dumb and irresponsible. Try again when you have something real. Very true great point. Also people with no insurance still get treated even without. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wanker Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 One missing piece of the Unaffordable Care Act is that if you do not buy insurance and pay the "fee" (fine) you are responsible for ALL of your medical expenses. Nothing will be covered. If I were in my early 20's and had no chronic health conditions it would make more sense to me to pay the fine for not having coverage. Why spend the money for insurance you're highly unlikely to need? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMoss Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 I can only see Wanker's posts when someone quotes the post. What Wanker is saying is that people went bankrupt before and they will continue to go bankrupt on Obamacare. So nothing has changed. I thought this was supposed to fix what was wrong with health care. I guess Obama lied, again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conklincolt Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 If I were in my early 20's and had no chronic health conditions it would make more sense to me to pay the fine for not having coverage. Why spend the money for insurance you're highly unlikely to need? And thats fine if they do.their fine money would help bring down the rates in the pools or they would be higher.so the fines are a good thing and they still dont have any insurance but their contribution will help others who need insurance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wanker Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 I can only see Wanker's posts when someone quotes the post. What Wanker is saying is that people went bankrupt before and they will continue to go bankrupt on Obamacare. So nothing has changed. I thought this was supposed to fix what was wrong with health care. I guess Obama lied, again. Funny, I don't recall Obama making sweeping promises that the ACA was going to fix everyone's problems forever and no one would ever sink deep into debt from medical bills. I must have missed that speech. One big factor in what's wrong with health care, and has been for awhile, is rampant litigation. Enormous, unnecessary and frivolous lawsuits have been driving up insurance costs for caregivers, drug companies and suppliers to the point we are at now: good, reliable health care is too expensive for the majority of Americans to afford out of pocket. How many other people take the time to block other people's posts , simply because they disagree with them? It's the online equivalent of sticking fingers in your ears and going "Nah, nah, nah, nah, nah....." And then to respond to the blocked posters only when they see someone else quote them? It's the online equivalent to Dad saying "tell your Mom she looks fat in those jeans" to his daughter because he hasn't spoken to his wife in 5 years even though he's still living in the same house cuz he's too cheap and stubborn to move out. Lame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logical Attacks Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 If I were in my early 20's and had no chronic health conditions it would make more sense to me to pay the fine for not having coverage. Why spend the money for insurance you're highly unlikely to need? If you're in your 20's and have no chronic health condition you'd likely purchase the catastrophic insurance choice. Which is fairly cheap and covers you if something crazy like a car accident happens. You still have that option until a certain age. Between subsidies and what not that insurance would likely be free or very cheap, and would still give you a few preventative (physicals etc) visits a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logical Attacks Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Very true great point. Also people with no insurance still get treated even without. People with no insurance are able to get stabilizing care, that doesn't mean chemo if you have cancer, that means you go to the hospital with a heart attack and they will stabilize you and then send you home. Not treat the underlying causes and what not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logical Attacks Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 One thing not brought up yet. If you get insured through obamacare you are covered only in a restrictive area. I will use as example a scenario we can all agree is plausible. If some drug dealer with obamacare in Binghamton takes a "re-up express" to the Port Authority and gets shot outside on the street. He is responsible for his medical bills. Remember the early cell phones with Regional Service? Would love to see the source on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logical Attacks Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 As far as the sheehan post, without him posting what actual plan he applied for, his family size, where he lives, and what have you it's impossible to verify if what he says is true. Even at 55k and single he'd still qualify for SOME subsidies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logical Attacks Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 My wife is a diabetic. We have insurance and she has never had a problem getting reimbursed. Maybe she isn't as bad as Mr. Sheehan's case. She figures it would cost about $200 per month if we had to pay out of pocket. In Mr. Sheehan's case, he is effectively paying for insurance... without having insurance in the sense we're used to. He is going to be paying outrageous monthly premiums while never, ever reaching his astronomical deductible. He is basically going to become one of the new slaves to Obamacare. The Chosen One will appreciate his financial contributions to the Collective. First off, what does the plan cover, deductibles are usually for major medical things like MRIs, surgeries, etc. Does the plan still have coinsurance? Does the plan offer discounts due to contracted fees negotiated with providers? What are the co-pays for normal visits? Does this cover his insulin and other pharmaceutical needs? The plan has to cover preventative care. Is he factoring that in? Does he get subsidies? What area of the country does he live in? Honestly it looks like he picked the worst case scenarios, posted that he hates the new plans, and ran with it, without giving any backing information or data that would verify his claims. Does he have a lot of medical problems? Would it be better if he upped his tier and end up paying slightly more in medical premiums to receive better coverage? These are things that without any background information you can't really claim obamacare as failing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMoss Posted October 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 If you're in your 20's and have no chronic health condition you'd likely purchase the catastrophic insurance choice. Which is fairly cheap and covers you if something crazy like a car accident happens. You still have that option until a certain age. Between subsidies and what not that insurance would likely be free or very cheap, and would still give you a few preventative (physicals etc) visits a year. Car insurance takes care of car accident injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMoss Posted October 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 People with no insurance are able to get stabilizing care, that doesn't mean chemo if you have cancer, that means you go to the hospital with a heart attack and they will stabilize you and then send you home. Not treat the underlying causes and what not They will test you and if you need a stent or something else they will do it and worry about the charges later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMoss Posted October 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 Would love to see the source on this one. It is called an EPO. Look it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMoss Posted October 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 First off, what does the plan cover, deductibles are usually for major medical things like MRIs, surgeries, etc. Does the plan still have coinsurance? Does the plan offer discounts due to contracted fees negotiated with providers? What are the co-pays for normal visits? Does this cover his insulin and other pharmaceutical needs? The plan has to cover preventative care. Is he factoring that in? Does he get subsidies? What area of the country does he live in? Honestly it looks like he picked the worst case scenarios, posted that he hates the new plans, and ran with it, without giving any backing information or data that would verify his claims. Does he have a lot of medical problems? Would it be better if he upped his tier and end up paying slightly more in medical premiums to receive better coverage? These are things that without any background information you can't really claim obamacare as failing. From your post, it is obvious that you have more than a little experience in this area. Possibly a lot of experience. How can someone like Mr Sheehan figure this out UNLESS they are a professional? Who can come in and analyze his and his family's medical expenses and pick the best plan? Only someone with a lot of health insurance experience. Which is a good reason to delay this disaster and better to terminate Obamacare. There are too many people, like Mr Sheehan, who have too many issues trying to figure out what to do with too many untrained people "guiding him" and a computer system disaster. They only have to Dec 15th to figure it all out. Epic disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logical Attacks Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 From your post, it is obvious that you have more than a little experience in this area. Possibly a lot of experience. How can someone like Mr Sheehan figure this out UNLESS they are a professional? Who can come in and analyze his and his family's medical expenses and pick the best plan? Only someone with a lot of health insurance experience. Which is a good reason to delay this disaster and better to terminate Obamacare. There are too many people, like Mr Sheehan, who have too many issues trying to figure out what to do with too many untrained people "guiding him" and a computer system disaster. They only have to Dec 15th to figure it all out. Epic disaster. I honestly don't have a ton of experience, I did due diligence on figuring out my options however. It's honestly not that hard to figure out, a few hours on the weekend, a basic understanding of what you paid out the year before in medical bills and should expect to pay out the next year and you're about 80% there. Here this article alone covers a vast amount of what you should be looking at: http://www.forbes.com/sites/investopedia/2013/10/01/how-to-choose-between-bronze-silver-gold-and-platinum-health-insurance-plans/ With a little more investigation, which honestly you SHOULD do if you're deciding something as important as your healthcare and you're set. People are to quick to run screaming for the hills and not do the small amount of work. On top of that there is a number to call for some help, between a small amount of legwork and assistance on the phone the vast majority of people should be a-okay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logical Attacks Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 Car insurance takes care of car accident injuries. As long as the person who hits you has car insurance yeah for the most part, let's take something else different maybe car accident was the wrong example. Let's say you fall down the steps and break a leg in two places. Between the surgery, emergency medical care, physical therapy and what not catastrophic insurance should help. Or let's say you're unlucky and get cancer at 25. Or what have you. There are a host of emergency medical reasons that a 20 year would be better off carrying at least catastrophic insurance. Will all of them use it? Maybe not. But enough will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logical Attacks Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 They will test you and if you need a stent or something else they will do it and worry about the charges later. Err, depending on the hospital that's really not true. A hospital like Lourdes maybe, as they're often willing to perform charity case work. But a lot of hospitals will not. Nor will they give you cancer treatments, nor will they give you physical and occupational therapy if you have a stroke and need to recover from that, nor will they be giving you monthly blood pressure medicines. Etc. There are a host of reasons why ER care isn't really health care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMoss Posted October 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 "I was laughing at Boehner -- until the mail came today," A man finds out what Obamacare is really about. A $10,000 increase in premiums. http://www.mercurynews.com/nation-world/ci_24248486/obamacares-winners-and-losers-bay-area Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conklincolt Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 the policy they had was real bad must be, didn't cover anything or little at all. my guess is they had only a supplement policy and not a full coverage policy. Or they were simply misquoted one way or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wanker Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 All I know is that both sides of this clown circus is quickly approaching lose/lose status. They're both acting like idiot schoolkids fighting over a bag lunch. While they punch and wrestle, the lunch gets ruined and no one gets its. One more time, the American public is paying for the Big Dick Contest that infects daily American politics. Whenever I hear either side talk about doing what's best for taxpayers or all Americans, I roll my eyes. Not only is either side interested in doing what's right for John Q. Public, they're so far away from understanding the realities we all face everyday that they're incapable of doing the right thing. If you feel the need to educate me on who's to really blame for the Moronic Mexican Shutdown Standoff, I ain't having any of it. See my italicized sentence. It doesn't matter who's right or who's to blame. They both think there's something to be won here. At first, before the shutdown, there was. Not any more. We pay, we all get more cynical about politics and they just go back to their lives and cash our checks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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