Guest Guest Posted February 22, 2013 Report Share Posted February 22, 2013 The league is weaker than it ever has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest3 Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Did JC beat anyone with a winning record? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 JC beat Norwich and Chenango Valley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 A basketball could win with the talent Ocker has this year, especially given that STAC talent is not even a sliver of a shadow of its former self. Norwich did great this year- they don't have the height/rebounders or the automatic shooting guards to kick to that a dribble-drive offense requires, but still they get it done. Hats off to them. 25-30 years ago they were a competitive wrestling school where basketball was an afterthought. For the past 20 years, they've been a perennial contender. So I'd say Abbott and now Collier are among the better coaches in STAC. Ocker has a good thing going there and is a decent coach, but to annoint him the best in these parts is premature. Part of the reason Ocker gets this talent is because he works with his kids in the off season more than any other local coach. Yes he has some great talent with Gallagher, Sinicki, Heimes, and Wisniewski but he has developed them into a solid team. And apparently Norwich didn't get the job done with their coaching especially. They should be running more sets and such. The schools are relatively the same size, so coaching is a major factor. Wins tell us who the best coach is in this scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Part of the reason Ocker gets this talent is because he works with his kids in the off season more than any other local coach. Yes he has some great talent with Gallagher, Sinicki, Heimes, and Wisniewski but he has developed them into a solid team. And apparently Norwich didn't get the job done with their coaching especially. They should be running more sets and such. The schools are relatively the same size, so coaching is a major factor. Wins tell us who the best coach is in this scenario. I haven't seen one person on here knock Coach Ocker. He puts in a lot of time in the off season. That doesn't change the fact on most nights he's coaching a team with more talent than his opponent. Last year was an exception and his team didn't win their division or the section. I'd be careful about comparing his accomplishments to Norwich. Rather than looking at 1 close game and declaring him the best, how about you look back over the last 3-5 years and see who's won more. I'll bet it's close and Norwich might have won more. According to NYSPHSAA M-E has 565 students Norwich has 485. That's a big difference and makes M-E an A school and Norwich a B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JC all the way Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Norwich without Sutton, right? One win against a +.500 team. I wouldn't call that too successful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Norwich without Sutton, right? One win against a +.500 team. I wouldn't call that too successful Are you saying ME isnt too successful? STAC championship isn't being successful? And they beat them twice, once with Sutton, once without Sutton. And to an earlier post.. 80 kids isn't that much of a difference.. And you saying who has won more means absolutely nothing. ME plays in the metro, the best division in all if STAC. Being a smaller school than the others, it makes sense that they don't have as good of a record cause they don't play crummy teams like Norwich does all year. And last year ME would have won that sectional championship game if not for a terrible charge call, they shut down Torto and ran Seton to death in the half court. That's all coaching. You're points are all irrelevant, and invalid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Torto, j connolly, and Burgo on bench at Cortland St. None of them play more than a few minutes if at all. This area is at an sll time low for hoops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Are you saying ME isnt too successful? STAC championship isn't being successful? And they beat them twice, once with Sutton, once without Sutton. And to an earlier post.. 80 kids isn't that much of a difference.. And you saying who has won more means absolutely nothing. ME plays in the metro, the best division in all if STAC. Being a smaller school than the others, it makes sense that they don't have as good of a record cause they don't play crummy teams like Norwich does all year. And last year ME would have won that sectional championship game if not for a terrible charge call, they shut down Torto and ran Seton to death in the half court. That's all coaching. You're points are all irrelevant, and invalid. Why don't you tell us who has won more, go look it up. Last 5 yrs, who won more M-E or Norwich. And 80 kids is a lot when your talking only 400-500 but that kind of math is probably over your head. You entire message can be summed up with blaming a loss on an officials call. Tells us all we need to know about your thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Are you saying ME isnt too successful? STAC championship isn't being successful? And they beat them twice, once with Sutton, once without Sutton. And to an earlier post.. 80 kids isn't that much of a difference.. And you saying who has won more means absolutely nothing. ME plays in the metro, the best division in all if STAC. Being a smaller school than the others, it makes sense that they don't have as good of a record cause they don't play crummy teams like Norwich does all year. And last year ME would have won that sectional championship game if not for a terrible charge call, they shut down Torto and ran Seton to death in the half court. That's all coaching. You're points are all irrelevant, and invalid. I have a feeling you read very slow so I'll spell it out "And you saying who has won more means absolutely nothing." Just look at M-E vs Norwich head to head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Torto, j connolly, and Burgo on bench at Cortland St. None of them play more than a few minutes if at all. This area is at an sll time low for hoops. How not to follow anyone but the Cortland State bunch! We have a D1 player on Binghamton University, A starter and captain on Oswego State, a starter and captain at Alfred University, and the all-time leading scorer at Swarthmore College. I don't think that is bad at all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Back in the 80's UE had 4 D1 players, SV had one..... Competition is slim. D3 is not D1 and BU is just above D3....barely. Vestal had a few as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 All that matters is who is better when they play head to head. ME apparently is now. Case closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2013 Report Share Posted February 24, 2013 I don't personally know Tom Torto but he was practically the poster boy for BX basketball. Who knows how much money his family dropped onto that business. And now he's on the bench for Cortland?!? a D III school? How did that happen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 24, 2013 Report Share Posted February 24, 2013 Start of 4th, Point 43-40 over SV..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 24, 2013 Report Share Posted February 24, 2013 I don't personally know Tom Torto but he was practically the poster boy for BX basketball. Who knows how much money his family dropped onto that business. And now he's on the bench for Cortland?!? a D III school? How did that happen? He was never as good as Kevin Stevens made him out to be. A nice HS player, not great. Not a college player. Played in a good system. End of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 24, 2013 Report Share Posted February 24, 2013 All that matters is who is better when they play head to head. ME apparently is now. Case closed. If that's the limit of your ability to think then I guess so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2013 Report Share Posted February 24, 2013 Are you saying ME isnt too successful? STAC championship isn't being successful? And they beat them twice, once with Sutton, once without Sutton. And to an earlier post.. 80 kids isn't that much of a difference.. And you saying who has won more means absolutely nothing. ME plays in the metro, the best division in all if STAC. Being a smaller school than the others, it makes sense that they don't have as good of a record cause they don't play crummy teams like Norwich does all year. And last year ME would have won that sectional championship game if not for a terrible charge call, they shut down Torto and ran Seton to death in the half court. That's all coaching. You're points are all irrelevant, and invalid. I was speaking about JC. Sorry for the miscommunication Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest why not Posted February 25, 2013 Report Share Posted February 25, 2013 Dave Springer, hands down. The rest of secIV. assumes the largest school in Sec. IV has the most athletic, tallest student body to pick next year's AA champs. Nothing could be further from the truth. The student body that coach Springer, and for that matter, Football coach Ramil are undersized. Name the last time BHS had 2 6'8"s like SV this year, or SCC the previous two years. Dave Springer got no respect for back to back Sec. IV and STAC Champs. The teams he put on the floor were competitive in AA, just could not beat Mount Vernon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 26, 2013 Report Share Posted February 26, 2013 Dave Springer, hands down. The rest of secIV. assumes the largest school in Sec. IV has the most athletic, tallest student body to pick next year's AA champs. Nothing could be further from the truth. The student body that coach Springer, and for that matter, Football coach Ramil are undersized. Name the last time BHS had 2 6'8"s like SV this year, or SCC the previous two years. Dave Springer got no respect for back to back Sec. IV and STAC Champs. The teams he put on the floor were competitive in AA, just could not beat Mount Vernon. What are you talking about? This post made me laugh. Springer has the biggest school around here to choose from for players. One of his problems is unlike Ocker in Maine Endwell or others around the area, he puts no effort into a youth program or any extra effort for his program. However he still has the two of the most talented players around in Curtis and Rose, and still cannot beat ME when it counts. Out coached in 2/3 of those games by Ocker. Plus last year he had Edwards, Rose, Sampson, and Edwards. One of the most loaded teams in years. He still gets whooped when he leaves sections by a great Mt Vernon school, but in fact has won some STAC championships and sections, as he should being one of the biggest schools and only having to play crummy UE in sections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jay Bilas Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Part of the reason Ocker gets this talent is because he works with his kids in the off season more than any other local coach. Yes he has some great talent with Gallagher, Sinicki, Heimes, and Wisniewski but he has developed them into a solid team. And apparently Norwich didn't get the job done with their coaching especially. They should be running more sets and such. The schools are relatively the same size, so coaching is a major factor. Wins tell us who the best coach is in this scenario. Whatever. Way to throw out a statement that you can't verify or prove. Do you go to the Y in Norwich? To the courts in Oneonta? How do you know Ocker spends more time than anyone else? Listen, he's a good coach. But a brain damaged monkey could win with the talented athletes M-E is experiencing now. It's happened lots of times- Binghamton in the 80s, Norwich in the 90s. None of these area coaches are outstanding geniuses. They're all fairly equal. Mackey has had some good teams at Oneonta, but without the horses lately, they've struggled. IF, and I mean IF, Ocker stays another 5-10 years and sustains this level of program dominance over his peers, then fine, he's the best in STAC. Like playing talent, the coaching talent ain't what it used to be either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Whatever. Way to throw out a statement that you can't verify or prove. Do you go to the Y in Norwich? To the courts in Oneonta? How do you know Ocker spends more time than anyone else? Listen, he's a good coach. But a brain damaged monkey could win with the talented athletes M-E is experiencing now. It's happened lots of times- Binghamton in the 80s, Norwich in the 90s. None of these area coaches are outstanding geniuses. They're all fairly equal. Mackey has had some good teams at Oneonta, but without the horses lately, they've struggled. IF, and I mean IF, Ocker stays another 5-10 years and sustains this level of program dominance over his peers, then fine, he's the best in STAC. Like playing talent, the coaching talent ain't what it used to be either. Ocker coaches two nights a week in Tony Lindsey's summer league, and one more in the JCC league. He also goes to two overnight camps with his players, and has two seperate spring AAU teams for M-E players only. That's quite the commitment I'd say, and he is not paid for any of that. I am a relative of a player know so I know all of this for fact. He may not be the greatest coach ever but he certainly is a good one, and he gets the most out of his teams year in and year out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jay Bilas Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Never said he wasn't a good coach. You have no idea of the level of commitment other coaches make. Trust me, it's as great or greater than Ocker. Some coaches don't have the talent or commitment on the part of the kids that Ocker enjoys. Anybody that couldn't win with this lot doesn't deserve to be in a gym let alone coaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Never said he wasn't a good coach. You have no idea of the level of commitment other coaches make. Trust me, it's as great or greater than Ocker. Some coaches don't have the talent or commitment on the part of the kids that Ocker enjoys. Anybody that couldn't win with this lot doesn't deserve to be in a gym let alone coaching. I see Ocker at EVERY summer league game and AAU tournament. I do see Mackey from Oneonta at most games. No one else even comes close. Ocker leads by example. You can't expect kids to be committed to something if you as a coach are not 100% committed? Ocker enjoys the fruits of his labor and it isn't an accident or just a character trait of this group of athletes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wooden Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Halloran could come out of retirement withoutwatching a AAU game the last 10 years and out coach everyone your talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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